So, Conservative radio is all in a tizzy today about Congress' apology for slavery. You'd think the sky was falling, and Negroes were about to stage some sorta coup.
The House of Representatives on Tuesday passed a resolution apologizing to African-Americans for slavery and the era of Jim Crow.Cohen, just in case you're wondering, succeeded Harold Ford in TN, and is up for re-election this year. So, yeah, there's prolly some political trickery going on here. This resolution is little more than a symbolic gesture. But ultimately it's little more than words. It won't change anything.
The nonbinding resolution, which passed on a voice vote, was introduced by Rep. Steve Cohen, a white lawmaker who represents a majority black district in Memphis, Tennessee. While many states have apologized for slavery, it is the first time a branch of the federal government has done so, an aide to Cohen said.
In passing the resolution, the House also acknowledged the "injustice, cruelty, brutality and inhumanity of slavery and Jim Crow."
"Jim Crow," or Jim Crow laws, were state and local laws enacted mostly in the Southern and border states of the United States between the 1870s and 1965, when African-Americans were denied the right to vote and other civil liberties and were legally segregated from whites.
The resolution does not address the controversial issue of reparations. Some members of the African-American community have called on lawmakers to give cash payments or other financial benefits to descendants of slaves as compensation for the suffering caused by slavery.
I can only surmise that much of the fear and controversy here is people assuming that reparations can't be far behind. You and I both know that unless black people controlled every single seat in the House and Senate, plus the White House, that could never happen. And it will never happen. And I'll go one step further and say it should never happen.
Reparations for slavery won't solve any of Black America's real problems. It is the root of many of them (self hatred, disconnected families, deepseated anger), but it won't solve any.
If Congress wanted to put some weight behind this calculated apology, they could do something to rectify the way schools are funded. There's no reason why inner city schools are literally crumbling[1], but those in the burbs (like where I live) are brand spankin' new. That sole inequality (tying school funding to the local tax base) is one huge issue they could tackle if so moved. But this will never happen of course.
Today, America's real racial problem is white privilege, something whites have the privilege of not even knowing it exists. I'd like to see some sorta apology and call to action for this. Of course, I'm not holding my breath.
Question: What do you think of Congress' apology for slavery and Jim Crow? What's your general feeling about reparations?
House apologizes for slavery, 'Jim Crow' injustices [CNN]
[1] And yes, I know, DC has the highest per-pupil funding rate in the country. But you and I both know that money never makes it to the schools themselves.
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I was on CNN and read the comments. People are losing their damn mind over this non-binding resolution.
Post-racial America=FAIL
i am more pleased to see an apology for jim crow than for slavery, because jim crow directly affected people who are right here right now. yes slavery was brutal, but white americans didn't recognize the humanity of african-americans. during jim crow, white america recognized that we were human, that we were good citizens, yet they still denied us our rights.
I was frying some chicken yesterday when I heard this on CNN...I got popped on the arm.
Anywho, I'm all for some form of reparations. Not the cash form, like "one big check" nor governmental welfare programs, but some sort of federal programs that provide checks and balances so that we, as citizens of this country can stop falling through the cracks.
You're right, educational funding, actual MONEY, needs to be upped in the urban centers. That has nothing to do with misappropriation of funds, but rather the lack thereof.
Ummmm, health care, of course, decent housing, and of course the list goes on. Personally, I always viewed affirmative action as some semblance of "repairing" the rift between the races, but clearly, white privilege kicks in and that results in another mountain to overcome.
I mildly joke, but am halfway serious, if there was some sort of "joke" reparations that were doled out, I'd personally want to see every African American (and yes, I'm quite clear about it being African American not blacks) handed a voucher to go see a counselor, free for a year, anytime, anywhere.
We have different burdens as African Americans in this country and as a result of us having to "sew our quilts" or "chop our wood" we have internalized much of our frustration and anger and when we express it, it comes out in negative ways.
I'm just mad Conyers is getting NO love on this even though he's been pushing this for a LONG time. And here comes the white guy with an all black district running against a black woman, who's going to go down in history as the one to get the resolution passed.
For info about "sewing your quilt" check out the link below. I just haven't figured out how to hyperlink stuff in here.
[http://uppitynegronetwork.wordpress.com/2008/07/29/in-honor-of-the-quilt-sewers/]
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the whole thing. Sounds like a bunch of smoke and mirrors to me.
As for reparations, you said it best, send it to the budgets that affect the schools and hospitals in the urban communities. We need more funding to keep the folk educated, off the streets, headed to college and a descent paying job.
Apologizing for slavery and its aftermath are ridiculously futile, but I guess it helps white liberals assuage their guilt.
On reparations, wasn't Chris Rock that said all they would do is make every Cadillac dealership rich?
Gotta cosign uppity on the slavery vs. Jim Crow apology. Btw, what party was they guy who proposed the resolution? Too bad it was only a voice vote, I would like to have seen a list of Congressmen who voted against this! Has anybody got a C-SPAN link of a clip of the vote?
Speaking of links, place the following all on one line (no hitting enter in the middle anywhere)to embed a link in the comments:
<
a href="URL_goes_here"
>link_text_goes_here<
/a
>
For example, here's a link to Obama stating his support for reparations today! I'm surprised you didn't link to this, AB. Here's the full quote:
"I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds." (my emphasis)
Senator, with regard to reparations, exactly what sort of deed do you propose?
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Maybe 15 years or so ago in Dallas, they started a program called Robin Hood to do exactly what AB suggests, i.e. divorce school funding from property values. Specifically they took money from the rich neighborhoods and gave it to poor schools. The result? The "rich" schools all got worse, and the "poor" ones got no better. It was such a disaster they had to end the system altogether.
If you want to help out schools, a socialist wealth redistribution system is NOT the way to do it! The solution is to let parents help their kids escape failing schools through a voucher system and support for charter programs. All the money in the world can't help a terrible school get much better.
In fact, the only place where a large cash infusion could possibly help a bad school is if the administrators spent it all on teacher salaries. Unfortunately, the Teacher's Unions prevent administration from firing teachers who don't deserve their current salaries, nevermind an increased one. There's simply no incentive for skilled teachers to work in a school, and the unions prevent administrators from creating one.
We'd be better off trying something new.. you know, a change from the failed policies of the past, rather than just throwing more money at the same bad idea.
Now where have I heard that before... damnit, I know I've heard somebody talk about change recently...
@spool32
That's doing to much to embed a link, lol
Yeah - this was a great big political group hug in an election year. Gee thanks...apology accepted, now can you fix real problems?
@Spool32 - we have a voucher-esque system her in Oakland - it's not vouchers, but if your neighborhood school sucks, you can apply to send your kids to other schools. The result: a backlog of students trying to get into the same schools, forcing students who live in district out of the school and stranding others at the underpeforming school.
How about we use the money to buy out the contracts of bad teachers? Or in early education efforts so our kids can read at grade level. How abotu in a sponsorship trust for college or for professional degree programs? How about prenatal and parenting classes. And yes like Uppity said - lots of counseling for all of us.
I do believe that Congress' apology will ultimately amount to nothing but words. I'm with everyone on that, but I keep asking myself why people are foaming at the mouth over "just words." And (sorry, spool), it just goes back to white privilege. I think our government publicly recognizing that it did some f*d up stuff to an entire segment of the population, the effects of which last today, is toying with the idea that we don't have what we want/need because we just didn't work hard enough.
The government acknowledging that, yeah, we played a HUGE ass role in the inequalities black people face today flies in the face that pervasive "just get the f--- over it" sentiment that, I think this group as a whole, sees for the craptastic cop-out that it is.
And I think it DOES lay *some* of the foundation for an argument in favor of government retribution for government ills. Though I am 100% AGAINST personal reparations checks.
@gracie:
I hate to hear it's created that sort of a mess... I guess the infrastructure isn't there yet to support the idea. On the other hand, it sounds like a business opportunity. Anybody building private schools in Oakland to take all this voucher money? If not, why not? Lack of interest? Lack of investment? Regulatory obstacles? Too busy with homeless overflow from the Tenderloin?
I like some of your suggestions, though I can't get behind buying out a contract for an employee who should be shitcanned for incompetence instead. I particularly like the sponsorship trust idea, and the prenatal/parenting class concept. I guess these are some areas where government money can do some good. Pouring it into the existing system is never gonna work, though.
@ill:
Oh come on. Is there any problem that doesn't go back to "white privilege"?
I don't believe it's the government's job to make sure you "have what you need". How the hell could you even define that? It's their job to make sure you have the opportunity to try and go get it for yourself, and to punish people who prevent you from doing so because of your race. If you fail because your parents never got over the awful shit that went down in the 50's, why is the government obligated to do something about it? You know, now that I think on it, the counterculture revolution and the liberalism of 60s society is pretty solidly to blame for my parents not being able to commit to a relationship, and so the government is sort of responsible for me growing up in a single-parent household. Likewise, the government's drug policy was to blame for my wife's dad getting tossed in the pen for dealing, so her home life was sorta their fault too.
I think an apology from, Congress, DEA and, and from Simon & Garfunkel, would begin the healing process...
Nevermind having what you want. I can't believe you threw that in there too! There's all sorts of stuff I want that the government and "white privilege" hasn't gotten me yet!
Somehow I'm getting screwed over here, I can sense it.
@spool said:"If you fail because your parents never got over the awful shit that went down in the 50's, why is the government obligated to do something about it?"
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Is anyone else really bothered by this statement, or is it just me? Do you have any African-American friends? Not people you know from work, or the guy who fixes your car, or the mailman...friends. Seriously.
@spool,
"Oh come on. Is there any problem that doesn't go back to "white privilege"?"
There are plenty. I'm not sure you heard what I was saying. I think that many, many, many people believe that black Americans are not reaping the benefits of the American Dream because they just aren't trying hard enough. That belief completely ignores that some of the barriers blacks have faced have been government sanctioned as recently as ONE generation ago.
"I don't believe it's the government's job to make sure you "have what you need"."
Nor do I. We are in agreement on this. I do believe it's the government's job to NOT INTENTIONALLY STAND IN THE WAY of you doing what is necessary to meet your basic human needs. Stuff like working a job or attending a school to get the training necessary for said job. When
"It's their job to make sure you have the opportunity to try and go get it for yourself, and to punish people who prevent you from doing so because of your race."
Agreed. If our government is the "people who prevent you from doing so because of your race" does it still stand that they should punish themselves, with a sanction of some kind?
"now that I think on it, the counterculture revolution and the liberalism of 60s society is pretty solidly to blame for my parents not being able to commit to a relationship, and so the government is sort of responsible for me growing up in a single-parent household."
Invalid point. We are not arguing the same thing. I'm arguing practices supported by legislation. You're arguing societal values of the time.
"Nevermind having what you want. I can't believe you threw that in there too! There's all sorts of stuff I want that the government and "white privilege" hasn't gotten me yet!"
Hmmm, I'll give you this one. BUT, I threw in wants because not everyone agrees on what is a want versus a need. Like college education. I believe people need it nowadays. Some people consider that a luxury.
@ebw,
no you aren't the only one bothered by that statement. like i said before, those kind of statements come from a vantage point of privilege.
@ all,
sorry for the long post above.
@uppity, great post about "sewing your quilt"! Thank you for sharing.
Sorry, I won't accept having my thoughts stuffed into the elastic catchall of "white privilege". Those kinds of statements come from a vantage point of limited government. It's simply not the government's duty to give you something because of stuff that happened to your grandparents or your parents, even if the stuff was done by people who held an elected office back then. Did your dad get a firehose turned on him in the 60s? He deserves justice and compensation for that! But you don't.
Firstly, @ebw:
Yeah, since highschool in rural Louisiana, where I was one of 5 white kids in the school. I could go on... my friends from highschool are the only people I stayed in touch with from Louisiana when I left for college in the Northeast.
I still don't think the US Government is responsible for helping you get over the lingering psychological effects of slavery.
@ill:
Perhaps we were failing to understand, because it seems like we're in almost perfect agreement here.
If our government is the "people who prevent you from doing so because of your race" does it still stand that they should punish themselves, with a sanction of some kind?
The People should sanction them, firstly be removing them from office, and secondly by prosecuting them for civil rights violations.
On the topic of college, I wouldn't agree that you need a college education to succeed.. in fact, it's often a waste of time and money. You can make a better income learning to operate a crane than you can ever make with a degree in African American Studies. Or Philosophy. Or Art History. I could go on... I've got a degree in English Lit. :) It's why I'm in the computer industry. If I'd chosen instead to learn a trade, I'd be making $150K/year or more by now.
I see a lot more Help Wanted signs in auto repair shops than I do in the Humanities Dept. at UT.
Oh, and I wasn't really trying to argue the govt. owes me something because my parents got divorced... I was just being a smartass. ;)
I still want my white privilege HDTV, though.
@spool,
"Sorry, I won't accept having my thoughts stuffed into the elastic catchall of "white privilege". Those kinds of statements come from a vantage point of limited government."
I can accept that. We're not in total agreement, but I can accept a general small government perspective. But, and this is a serious question, not smartassness, but do you believe that the reparations as they exist for Native Americans should be eliminated? I ask because most folks I know are fine with that, but don't understand how the same generational hurdles exist for African-Americans.
Aaaannnd...it just occurred to me that this is perhaps the wrong thread for this discussion. After all, we had an AA thread yesterday.
AB, you wanna give a ruling on this? I can hit spool up on e-mail if you think we have derailed the thread.
This is my very first post. I felt compelled to comment because I am the FIRST generation of 6 traced generations here that did not have to pick cotton. My mother left Mississippi in 1970 with "white" and "colored" signs still up. The gov't does have a role in addressing the inequities between AfAms and the rest of America because of white privilege. When you talk about land wealth, life insurance policies, access to well paying jobs...That was not available to all Americans just one generation ago. White families are leap years ahead with savings and wealth and it was a right many black hand that got them there. I mean what was my tired grandfather or grandmother supposed to do? Put down sharecropping, get a suit and go apply for a job at the bank? And what about the first wave of out of wedlock black children in this country? They had WHITE fathers! We can't get to healing psychologically and be self-actualized when we have people who don't believe that they are even welcomed in their own country. We need a "Welcome to America" check better known as 40 acres AND a mule.
News flash:
All the slaves ARE DEAD!
All the slavemasters ARE DEAD!
Reparations arent going to change a thing.
As for the jim-crow laws, well its good that the Democrats are apologizing for the things they have done to black people after reconstruction dont you think?
No amount of money is going to fix Black culture. They dont want it fixed. Pride in illiteracy, illegitimacy, and felonious behavior are problems that no amount of money can fix.
Barak is already doing some "Deeds" by showing that its possible for blacks to prosper and even to be president.
Its up to Black people to do the rest, if they really want to.
@ Daedalus,
"No amount of money is going to fix Black culture. They dont want it fixed. Pride in illiteracy, illegitimacy, and felonious behavior are problems that no amount of money can fix."
What do you mean by this? I'm serious. I don't want to make any accusations or rants against this because I'm not sure what you mean. I've assumed for months that you are black, but at times you seem to have a great distaste for American black people, as a whole. In my life I've met a TON of black folks who embody what you've written here: they like being thugs and they think that education is siditty and that use of proper English signals a deep desire to be white. However, the overwhelming majority of black people I know are young professionals in a variety of industries.
Many of your comments suggest to me that you believe that me and my circle of young professional black friends are anomaly, that the prevailing black culture in America is one of ignorance and criminality. Am I way off-base?
I've been mulling on this and the affirmative action-post for a couple of days and this is how I feel:
formal apologies are in order because the government as an institution does carry responsibility for actions in the past. Yes, different people were in office then, but as an institution there is a straight line from then to now. The institution should always hold itself accountable for past decisions. The pope did not (I hope)personally abuse children, but we all expect him to apologize for those within the institution of the church that did. The former pope did not persecute Jews himself, but when he apologized for the role of the church in persecutions throughout the ages everyone applauded that. When the German government apologized for the holocaust it was not done by officials who were in office then etc. So why should this be different? You don't apologize to slaves individually, you apologize to a people that existed then and exists now. Why does everyone get so upset about that? And yes, it is mainly symbolic, but that doesn't mean it's empty. It says that the government acknowledges wrongs of the past and wants to do better.
I'm also a bit tired off the whole reparations thing. As Stankoniforous 0ne said, go over to CNN and read the comments: it's not pretty. What's so wrong with making some kind of reparations towards those on whose (unpaid) backs a lot of wealth was accumulated? We all know you can't pay reparations to individual people today. But what is so wrong with reparations being paid to strengthen the black community? To strengthen schools, making neighborhoods good places to live? To make sure that the pool of talent in the US is explored to its fullest?
Yes, a lot of it has to do with white privilege. It just has. I know Spool doesn't see it like that and I'm not talking up 'white guilt'. It was very hard work for me to get where I am today. Not coming from a wealthy background and going where no other member of my family had gone before made it very hard and I'm proud of what I accomplished so far. But...it would have been harder still if I hadn't been white. Why is that so hard to acknowledge? I got breaks that someone else might not have gotten. I was talking to this guy the other day who had applied for an internship and was told that they had no spots available. Two days later a girl from his class got an internship at the same company. His grades are better than hers, but she's white and his parents are Moroccan. Now we also have affirmative action over here and when that's applied in the right way, when equally qualified give the position to someone from a minority group, it would make itself redundant within two decades. So something else must be up when affirmative action doesn't work. It just bugs me that we can never say that racism is a big part of why minorities don't get more ahead. It is. It just is. If you look around you you see it all the time. Yesterday I walked into a drugstore and wondered around a bit aimlessly because I had forgotten what I needed to get, but I knew it was important and that I should really get it. Nobody was paying any attention to me walking around like that. Then this guy (about 16 years old) came in, walked to an aisle and seemed to be sort unsure of what to get and the woman who was helping me at the cash-register walked to that aisle, folded her arms and just stood there watching the guy until he was finished. He was ofcourse not white and the poor guy was getting condoms so he must have been nervous anyway. The way she was watching him was so infuriating, but I know that if I had said something about it being racist she would never have recognized her own behavior for what is was. Even though she had let me walk around like a potential shoplifter for minutes without even a glance.
There’s not a rational objection to be made against reparations and/or an apology. It just boils down to this: are you willing to share your candy? Are you willing to say that as a country you’re doing good, but that you could be doing great if you invested what you should have invested years ago into communities that are lagging behind because they didn’t get the start you got? Because working hard isn’t always enough to get ahead, you need to have the infrastructure and the opportunities too.
Just a question, how come we never see or hear anything from the congressional Black Caucus unless it's election time. I don't know of any member of the black caucus who is on any major committee or who has sponsored a major bill. My state senator has been in office for 20 yrs, but he can't tell me on major thing that he has done, He even voted to allow pawn shops to charge over 500 percent in this state,When everybody knows that pawn shops are the black mans ATM's What we need is a citizen bill of rights, it's just not enough any more just to be black, you gotta do something.
Jusus.
@anonymous (the one right above me)
We only hear from the CBC because this is the only time MSM decides to give them coverage. However, C-SPAN is a good bet to hear from them at other times.
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